Hmm...

[enteirah]

This is just something that's been rolling around in my mind for a while now, which I'm going to try and waffle on about here as I'm bored.

As Entei-rah, a lapine furry, I act on considerably different to how I would ever act on in real life. I get on better with other furries, and I can form quite strong bonds to some. The thing is, I just can't do the same with humans. I've always hated people, that's no secret, and presumably always will. This is where the strange part is to me though. I just couldn't form the same attachment with the person behind a furry character either. No matter how hard I try... it's still a person. That's the main reason I don't like furmeets. True, they're all furs... but at the end of the day they're still human, something I could never feel comfortable about.

It's something I really try and fail to make sense of though. How can you like a furry, yet not feel the same about the person behind them? At the end of the day, the thoughts and feelings of the fur *are* the thoughts and feelings of the person. The two are not separable, and never could be. It's a fact I know... so how come something about it just refuses to click in my mind. =:S

I guess this is a good part of the reason I have T++++ in my furcode. I'm in favour of transformation, mainly because it would allow the escape of the constraining fact of us all still being in a human body. Whilst it would introduce it's own problems I'm sure, it would make things like this so much less complicated.

Maybe I'm just losing my mind? Who knows!

Comments

[huskyteer.livejournal.com]

> At the end of the day, the thoughts and feelings of the fur *are* the thoughts and feelings of the person.

I dunno - I have quite a different behaviour set for when I'm in 'fur mode', at a furmeet or among furs. Normally I hate to be touched, for example, but I give and receive hugs quite happily as Huskyteer. I think this is true for a lot of us. And I suspect that the difference between furry and human behaviour is even more pronounced in an environment like IRC or a MUCK, where you can perform more outrageous actions *ahem*

I certainly prefer the appearance of many furs' avatars to their human form - my own included :)

[enteirah]

I dunno - I have quite a different behaviour set for when I'm in 'fur mode', at a furmeet or among furs.

I can see the point you're making there, but even if there are kind of two 'modes', they're both still thoughts originating from the same mind; namely yours in this case. I guess it's just that bit I have such difficulty getting some sort of cohesive thinking around; how can it really be possible to separate the two mindsets? I've never been much good at making sense of anything this deep I guess.

[huskyteer.livejournal.com]

I'm also tempted to suggest that you just haven't met the right people yet :)

[avon-deer.livejournal.com]

With ya there. I much prefer furs to non furs. Lapine furs are nice as well...not enough of them about. ;)

[enteirah]

Lapine furs are nice as well...not enough of them about. ;)

Not many rabbits... but lots of foxes! Eep! We're outnumbered. =;)

[avon-deer.livejournal.com]

Too many wolves for this deer's liking. ;)

[porsupah.livejournal.com]

Hee! A set of very good points indeed, and to a good extent, I'd have to agree with them. Although I confuse myself a lot even there, as I'm very hesitant about coming along to a LondonFurs meet at some point, as I much prefer being thought of as the furry me, rather than the unfurry me. Of course, there's also just shyness involved, as I'd happily corral Brigus, Dizzy, Toraneko, Helvetica, Jumell, and RabitGuy together for an outing to appreciate the excellence of Jupiter's pizza, or the joyfully good cask ales of the Magnolia Cafe. ^_^

The differences of one's furry self and otherwise? Well - I'm not much of one for small children, generally speaking; human children are often so noisy, for one thing. ^_^;;; But, as Red.. well, at one set of evenings at the SF Zoo, I had the most fun in a long, long time, bringing such pleasure to so many little ones, sometimes having to tease out their curiosity, and for a brief time, try to earn their trust. It's quite an experience, almost transformational in nature.

(Hm. Know anywhere that needs a red panda for hire? ^_^)

Similarly, I've no ambition to be a parent as a human, but as a red panda, I could see things being very different.

[enteirah]

Well, whilst I don't like people, I really hate children and always have. Yes, I'm a miserable sort. =:(

[porsupah.livejournal.com]

Bah! Bunnies can't be miserable, surely?

Still, you might want to read this posting from toraneko, wherein she describes a fairly surreal time at a neighborhood coffee house. *sigh*

[ethethlay.livejournal.com]

I don't mind people as much, but I agree with you on the children part. I can not stand children. Being under the legal driving age, I am forced to ride the school bus with a load of intolerable elementary and middle school children. The fact that the bus ride is an hour long doesn't help matters any.

[loganberrybunny.livejournal.com]

I wish I could think of something really interesting to say in response to this, but even so, as you've gone to all the trouble of writing it (in public view, too) I think I ought to have a go. Apologies in advance for the waffliness, but I'm sure you expected that...

It's no secret that I really dislike those (relatively few) furs who say, "I hate humans" in the sense of saying that they're somehow not human. After all, whatever our feelings about the matter, we're all human, and so people who do that are insulting all of us. However, I appreciate that that's not what you're saying. Your difficulty, it seems, is that you know you're human but wish you weren't. As someone who rather likes humanity in general, I'm obviously sad you feel that way.

However... it does seem odd that you feel okay with furry characters of all sorts of species, but not with humans. Can it really be true that any species other than Homo sapiens is all right? That would seem to imply the sort of division between "humans" and "animals" that you've said that you dislike. Yes, in many ways humans are exceptional... but what you're talking about here is character rather than technology and so on, and there I don't think there is such a division.

I must admit, though, that in general I think of my furry friends pretty much exclusively as their characters. When I see a photo of a fur in RL, it generally feels a bit... semi-detached, and not merely because I haven't met them in RL. But seeing their character's pic is another matter; that generally feels... "right."

It's tricky, since that "the two are not separable" thing you say is at the very centre of my own feelings on this, and yet I have to recognise the truth in what you say: I do think of you as "Entei-rah" pretty much exclusively, since in my mind that's who you are.

I've always hated people, that's no secret, and presumably always will.

*sigh* I'll confess that I find it slightly irritating when you say things like that. I know you're strong-minded, but you simply can't know that at this stage of your life. People change - after all, I had no idea I was a fur till I was 27! I just hope you're not being deliberately close-minded on the subject, that's all. =:/

Anyway, that's probably enough waffling for one comment. Very thought-provoking, even if - as I say - a little bit sad.

[enteirah]

is that you know you're human but wish you weren't.

Yeah, that sounds like a pretty good summation there, which is where all that stuff I've discussed about transformation recently comes in.

That would seem to imply the sort of division between "humans" and "animals" that you've said that you dislike

Which is another fact I'm well aware of (and was something I actually meant to mention on this post, oops). I know people *are* just another animal... yet they seem to be about the only one I can't like; there's some distinction still lingers in my mind, even if I don't want it there. =:S

I just hope you're not being deliberately close-minded on the subject, that's all. =:/

I dont know to be honest. Whilst in theory I could change it, and opportunities do crop up from time to time, something is there in my mind that refuses to budge, and it's not something I feel I have any real control over. *sigh*

[silvante.livejournal.com]

*looks at you in puzzlement*

< the thoughts and feelings of the fur *are* the thoughts and feelings of the person>

That is just not true, I mean comeon Bunny, Russet when i am in fantasy mode is an Imortal Elemental Mage and a Aristocrat.

At furmeets i'm a totally different person then i am with my other friends. I mean to them i am Ashley the polite, mild mannered Historian/Librarian

At a furmeet i am Russet, kind lovable bouncy Skunk creature,

It is all just a different way of expressing myself in RL and to steal a quote from Shrek, i'm like an onion there are many layers to this Skunk

[enteirah]

the thoughts and feelings of the fur *are* the thoughts and feelings of the person

Gah, I'm really starting to think I should have found a better way to word that sentence you know. I know there are differences in ways of acting and thinking, but the point I was trying to make is that, in this example, Russet in fantasy mode is still your thoughts; someone hasn't transplanted your mind and started thinking for you/him. Hmm... If I'm still making no sense (quite probable), then just read my last line, and that pretty much sums up everything. =;)

i'm like an onion there are many layers to this Skunk

Well you can make eyes water I suppose! =:P *ducks and runs*

[silvante.livejournal.com]

*throws fire at you and watches your fur singed* bad BUnny just you wait i'm going to spank you till your sorry for that *runs after you with a broom*

[enteirah]

Eeeep! Not the broom! Anything but the broom! *giggles and runs*